"Stupid" question for SEing

I used to do SE in the past but only for cheap products, mostly on eBay, Alibaba, Groupon and so on, I always basically used the DNA method.
Up to that time I thought I was the only one to do that.
Then I stopped do that. About 2 month ago I started again after an unpleasant purchase episode with a company, I was thinking of getting a "little revenge" from them; I found by chance some information about the "SE world" in some online forums (including this) and then I discovered the big world that there was around this business, I figure out that I was not only the one to did that but also there were people smarter than me in doing it. And this is way I started again doing it, I was thinking of starting again to do this with cheap things and then resell it but I want to grow and use my time more efficiently and also not make small sellers to lose their money. Let's hunt the big fish.
I want to invert a small daily portion of my time studying and doing SE.

After this long introduction (sorry about that if you didn't appreciate).

I would like to discuss in this thread all precaution who a SE' users must take, here there are some question for those who are most expert:
- I think that the answer to this question will be yes, but, do you use your own identity and why?
- Where couriers deliver your package? Your main home address, a friend's address, a third party address (such as restaurant and so on), abandoned address... where?
- What name you insert in the delivery address? Your 100% real name or your name with some "alteration"? Such as: Alice -> Alicze.
- Do you always use a VPN when doing SE? Do you use other precautions?
- Is there other information which I forgot that you think somebody who wants to do things in a good and secure way must do?
- Do you perform the same SE (or similar) to the same company? If yes after how many days/weeks?
- What do you check on the TOS of the website to understand how much is the probability of your SE's success?

I hope this thread might be useful for all the other users who are in my same situation.

(07-09-2020, 10:55 PM)green314 Wrote:

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I used to do SE in the past but only for cheap products, mostly on eBay, Alibaba, Groupon and so on, I always basically used the DNA method.
Up to that time I thought I was the only one to do that.
Then I stopped do that. About 2 month ago I started again after an unpleasant purchase episode with a company, I was thinking of getting a "little revenge" from them; I found by chance some information about the "SE world" in some online forums (including this) and then I discovered the big world that there was around this business, I figure out that I was not only the one to did that but also there were people smarter than me in doing it. And this is way I started again doing it, I was thinking of starting again to do this with cheap things and then resell it but I want to grow and use my time more efficiently and also not make small sellers to lose their money. Let's hunt the big fish.
I want to invert a small daily portion of my time studying and doing SE.

After this long introduction (sorry about that if you didn't appreciate).

I would like to discuss in this thread all precaution who a SE' users must take, here there are some question for those who are most expert:
- I think that the answer to this question will be yes, but, do you use your own identity and why?
- Where couriers deliver your package? Your main home address, a friend's address, a third party address (such as restaurant and so on), abandoned address... where?
- What name you insert in the delivery address? Your 100% real name or your name with some "alteration"? Such as: Alice -> Alicze.
- Do you always use a VPN when doing SE? Do you use other precautions?
- Is there other information which I forgot that you think somebody who wants to do things in a good and secure way must do?
- Do you perform the same SE (or similar) to the same company? If yes after how many days/weeks?
- What do you check on the TOS of the website to understand how much is the probability of your SE's success?

I hope this thread might be useful for all the other users who are in my same situation.

Hey,
first off its important to note that there is not one single answer to all of those questions. It's always highly dependant on the item and product youre trying to SE.
Using your own identity might be okay for smaller and one time se's, but as soon as it involves a high priced item it is recommended to take safety precautions.
It is basically the same thing for your delivery address. Using your own / Friends addy should be fine for most of the SE's but there are always exceptions for certain companies so always be sure to double check whether its okay to use your own or if you have to use a drop addy.
Spoofing the name is always recommended as the parcel will end up at your desired address anyways, but again its dependant on the company and the frequency you want to SE it. Its sometimes even of benefit to fake the signature if the courier asks for one.
In terms of security its always good to have a decent opsec (apart from SE stuff). A vpn is highly recommended as if the se fails and they start an investigation you are safer than without a vpn. As you contact most of the companies via email its also recommended to use f.i. protonmail, as in case of an investigation providers like gmail will pass your data without any hesitation to the company. There are greate threads regarding OPSEC on this forum just do a quick search and Im sure that you will get and idea of what you need for a SE and what not.
There is no set duration you have to wait before you can se a company again. It is dependant of the company and the item. For Logitech f.i. I recommend waiting at least a month between every SE if youre planning to use the same addy.
In the TOS of a company you mostly check who the accountable is in case of package loss and if you have to ship a defect item back or not in order to get a refund or replacement. This is dependant on the method youre planning to use as each method requires different TOS premises.

Good luck with your SE's and dont rush to the big fish as it is sometimes better to take it slowly to get to know the company and most important to not make any mistakes (and even if you do you should have a good opsec by then :wink: )
For further information you can check out

[To see links please register here]

the SE blog of @"mothered" or just reply in the comments. Im certain there are many people besides me willing to clarify things even more.

Best Regards,
Kost

do you use your own identity and why?

Yes.

Do remember that as far as any company Is concerned, every SE Is a legit claim, hence there's nothing to hide.

Where couriers deliver your package? Your main home address, a friend's address, a third party address (such as restaurant and so on), abandoned address... where?

It depends on the nature of the SE- each Is taken on a case-by-case basis.

However, do not get friends and neighbors Involved. In the event of an Investigation, It will complicate matters.

What name you insert in the delivery address? Your 100% real name or your name with some "alteration"? Such as: Alice -> Alicze.

Already answered In the first point above.

Do you always use a VPN when doing SE? Do you use other precautions?

If I have the need to create a second account, namely to prevent any form of association/link to the original account, then yes a VPN Is used.

Is there other information which I forgot that you think somebody who wants to do things in a good and secure way must do?

Evidently, I have no Idea how a given SE'er Is setup, thus It's not possible to be definitive on this.

Do you perform the same SE (or similar) to the same company?

Yes.

If yes after how many days/weeks?

There are no hard and fast rules.

It's always good practice to allow a significant gap between each SE, and to avoid raising suspicion, use different methods.

What do you check on the TOS of the website to understand how much is the probability of your SE's success?

Research Is of the utmost Importance prior to performing a given SE. As such, the method can be formulated based on your findings.

The "main" things to look for Include (but not limited to):

* Who's responsible for loss of goods during transit.
* Refund and replacement policies.
* Warranty period for selected Items.
* Is there a non-tracking service available.
* The carrier used (very Important for the DNA).
* Whether ARs (Advanced Replacements) are given.
* Is the account debited for non-return of goods.
* Do they respond to PayPal disputes/claims (further research Is required).

And the list goes on.

(07-10-2020, 04:12 AM)mothered Wrote:

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Where couriers deliver your package? Your main home address, a friend's address, a third party address (such as restaurant and so on), abandoned address... where?

It depends on the nature of the SE- each Is taken on a case-by-case basis.

However, do not get friends and neighbors Involved. In the event of an Investigation, It will complicate matters.

You're right. Thanks for the suggestion.

(07-10-2020, 04:12 AM)mothered Wrote:

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If yes after how many days/weeks?

There are no hard and fast rules.
It's always good practice to allow a significant gap between each SE, and to avoid raising suspicion, use different methods.

Yes, sure.

(07-10-2020, 04:12 AM)mothered Wrote:

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What do you check on the TOS of the website to understand how much is the probability of your SE's success?

Research Is of the utmost Importance prior to performing a given SE. As such, the method can be formulated based on your findings.

The "main" things to look for Include (but not limited to):

* Who's responsible for loss of goods during transit.
* Refund and replacement policies.
* Warranty period for selected Items.
* Is there a non-tracking service available.
* The carrier used (very Important for the DNA).
* Whether ARs (Advanced Replacements) are given.
* Is the account debited for non-return of goods.
* Do they respond to PayPal disputes/claims (further research Is required).

And the list goes on.

Could you please specify what do you mean with:
(1) * The carrier used (very Important for the DNA).
(2) And those highlight in red, I understand what you mean, but I never ever read of them in the ToS. I mean, I never read how companies act in those situations, it's not always written in the ToS, or at least not clearly.
Sometimes you do know which carrier the website will use to shipping with, but it's probable that it's not only one type, maybe 3-4 companies are delegated to shipping the items sold by the website. And secondly, what kind of relevant information could you extract from it? Yes okay each shipping-company has their own rules about the "prohibited items", items which are not allowed to be shipped (thus resent) but except this, is there other worthy information you can extract?

Thanks.

(07-14-2020, 12:17 AM)green314 Wrote:

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Could you please specify what do you mean with:
(1) * The carrier used (very Important for the DNA).

This Is just one of many benefits.

If they do not accept a signature on delivery, then It's perfect DNA material.

(07-14-2020, 12:17 AM)green314 Wrote:

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(2) And those highlight in red, I understand what you mean

* Is there a non-tracking service available.

Upon the company's request, you (seemingly) return the Item via non-tracking and given It obviously cannot be tracked, It's assumed to be lost In transit.

* Is the account debited for non-return of goods.

When an AR Is Issued by the company and you don't send the defective Item, they may debit your account.

* Do they respond to PayPal disputes/claims (further research Is required).

Non-compliance by the company, will result In a successful PayPal refund to the account holder.